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Post by oldmoleskins on Oct 6, 2006 19:20:32 GMT
I was going to post this on marypoppins "first produce planted on lottie" in response to karenwl's request for info on applying, but a) she was given the right advice and b) I didn't want to go off topic and hijack it so:
I was on a Parish Council until recently in Herts, and in our village we had less than 50% uptake of our allotments - at 7 quid a year.
We subsidised the few that used them (and were pleased to do it) but the biggest criticsm was no water supply.
How do you lotties get on - do you all have water? If not, how much of a problem is it?
OM
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Post by jlottie on Oct 6, 2006 19:37:01 GMT
Still having a battle with my council to provide a water supply. We all lost a lot of crops this year due to the lack of water and there wasn't even a water shortage. I haven't given up though and now have 12/15 signatures supporting the application for a water supply. Next week a representative from the NSALG is coming down for a visit to give us some advice they are also contacting the local water supplier to investigate the cheapest way to get a supply on site. The Office of the Deputy Prime Minister has a useful site regarding allotments and it states that a water supply is essential - think my council are deaf and can't read though. www.communities.gov.uk/index.asp?id=1127694 |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2006 21:57:02 GMT
Hi
I'm obviously one of the lucky ones as we have water on our plot, and we are able to use hosepipes. the site is about 35-40 plots and we have 3 water taps. I also have 3 waterbutts catching the rain water from my shed roof.
I'm not excessive with my watering but I do think a supply is essential at any allotment.
OM - I wish my plot was £7 a year !!
jlottie - Good Luck with the council !!
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Post by beejay on Oct 9, 2006 7:57:13 GMT
When we first took on our allotment we had water from dip tanks located at various places around the site. Later, when a local councillor was an allotment holder, we had taps installed so we could use hoses. This year of course we have only been able to use the dip tanks again which has been a tough task. I would hate to be on a site with no water supplied. There is a limit to how much water you can keep in a water butt(s). Mind you, I have heard of sites where they are not allowed those!  |
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Post by sweetleaf on Oct 9, 2006 10:52:57 GMT
Now dont get me going! There are taps on my plot but this summer the nearest one began to leak underground,and they couldnt find the tap to turn it off, it took months to get it repaired and it was surrounded by a deep puddle,all that time. Eventually they fixed it but the very first time I used it the whole tap assembly blew off!, cracked at the thread, it was either overtightened and cracked by the plumber, or the water pressure was too high, I was told.I was lucky I wasnt standing in its path, or I might have caught this chunk of brass in the stomach, it travelled several yards before it hit the ground. Fortunately there is a "secret" tap at the back of the column which I used to turn off the water this tap is now useless again.  Lord knows how much precious water was wasted, during the long wait for repair, many emails were sent to the council pointing this out, but now the tap is broken again, I wonder how long it will take them to send a plumber this time?  |
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Post by 4pygmies on Oct 9, 2006 14:31:07 GMT
It finished me off with my allotment! A couple of years I took an allotment at our nearest village which was great at first - it got ploughed every Spring for a tenner and it was huge BUT it had no water. We weren't allowed any sheds or structures and no permanent compost heaps so there was no way to collect any rainwater. It was impossible to cart enough to even water in sowings properly as we had no access for vehicles either. I was killing myself for hours every evening just trying to keep things alive so I gave up. Originally I wanted an allotment as the rats were eating everything in my garden but after an epic campaign we seem to have got them down to manageable numbers and I haven't had any problems with them eating things this year. I just don't think it's feasible to effectively grow things on an allotment without a decent water supply. It's not really fair to expect people to pay for land without providing them with water either.
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Post by oldmoleskins on Oct 9, 2006 16:01:55 GMT
Well, I was staggered to learn of the lack of water in our case and campaigned for a supply - only to meet an unexpected obstacle.
The adjoining playing field committee - a village charity, no less - had a mains water supply (to their hall) within 100m of the allotments, we had a donor who'd offered to moleplough the pipe, a donor who'd given a tank and a meter to ensure fair play, and after months of 'discussion' we still couldn't pin them down to agreeing the connection. I started the ball rolling in 2004 and left 9 months ago - they may still be talking about it...
OM
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Post by jlottie on Oct 10, 2006 22:42:05 GMT
OM can you give me some tips as to where to go for funding or grants if the Council still refuse to help. Any advice would be a great help. The plots are on Council land and they are the only plots owned by the Council, all the others in the district are run by the parishes. What is worrying me is that its the Estate Dept that runs the site not the Leisure Dept and there is talk that building of new houses will commence in the area in the next few years. |
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Post by oldmoleskins on Oct 11, 2006 8:00:28 GMT
jlottie, sorry to say I don't think I can add much to your store of knowledge... certainly don't know of any funding sources.
There is, I believe, an obligation on the part of LA's to provide allotments, but it would seem (if only from this thread) that the level of 'service' provided is hugely variable - which suggests it's optional.
I wouldn't see anything sinister in the Estates Dept being 'the one' it's usual for any farms or smallholdings to be under their control, so I guess by extension allotments would be there too.
Regarding your development fears, though, I have a horrible feeling that if you looked at the terms of your 'lease' agreement it will show that notice to quit can be given... the proviso would be that an alternative allotment elsewhere be offered. You should maybe start to lobby local Copuncillors for an assurance that your allotments are 'safe' and have a go at Prescott while he's still there too!!
Is it an 'active' group of gardeners? - are the plots well tended? If I was a Council looking for an easy target, I'd go for the low uptake, poorly maintained patch as offering least resistance...
Please let us know how you get on...
OM
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Post by sweetleaf on Oct 11, 2006 8:27:18 GMT
Is it an 'active' group of gardeners? - are the plots well tended? If I was a Council looking for an easy target, I'd go for the low uptake, poorly maintained patch as offering least resistance... Please let us know how you get on... OM I really have to do something then, at least half the plots on my site arent rented and of those there are only mine and one other properly tended, OMG I might lose my plot! I know the council is actviely looking for a place to build "care in the community" homes.......... |
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Post by jlottie on Oct 11, 2006 8:35:37 GMT
Morning OM
Yes you are right I do have a clause covering notice to quit, I have been trying to find out if the site is statutory with little success as the Council never seem to have a straight answer for anything.
The SW rep of the NSALG is coming down today to have a look at the site, so hopefully he may have some good advice. There are only 15 plots and after getting some of the signatures its obvious that some are sub let which contravenes the rules and a couple are just turned over to keep the Council happy, its a shame as I know if the site was run properly it would be a much better place. I have to be very careful as I don't want to disturb a hornets nest - locals and all that. The chap in charge of the site visits rarely and hasn't got a clue about gardening which doesn't help.
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Post by jlottie on Oct 11, 2006 8:39:06 GMT
I really have to do something then, at least half the plots on my site arent rented and of those there are only mine and one other properly tended, OMG I might lose my plot! I know the council is actiely looking for a place to build "care in the community" homes.......... Sweetleaf, becoming a member of the NSALG might help you, there are reps all over the country that you can contact for advice, hopefully this visit today will point me in the right direction. Thankfully I have a councillor on my side and heres hoping I get the right ammo to fire back at the council. |
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Post by oldmoleskins on Oct 11, 2006 8:41:45 GMT
Noooo sweetleaf, sorry to have alarmed you, allotments are generally seen as 'sacred cows' in most areas as it's known they stir up 'passion' in the voters - most people are gardeners, even if they're not "lotties".
Jlottie seems to feel vulnerable being in an area targeted for development, so perhaps needs to seek reassurance from those concerned in the planning process.
Every Council everywhere is "looking for a place to build 'care in the community' homes..." or "affordable homes", so a declared policy like that isn't neccesarily a threat... but check it out with your local Councillor and attempt to get something "on the record' - they hate being made out to be hypocrits!!
Just before the last LA election the Conservative candidate came to me one evening and asked me to burn a letter I'd got from her as it contradicted her later stance...
OM
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Post by sweetleaf on Oct 11, 2006 8:59:42 GMT
OM Im not a bit surprised about that candidates backpedalling, I hope you didnt actually burn that letter?
Jlottie I shall get in touch with NSALG, theres a link on this site, I think I actually sent it in, although Im not yet a member, because it had advice on the site about how to get your first allotment.
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Post by jlottie on Oct 11, 2006 14:23:44 GMT
Had an interesting meeting this afternoon and the outcome is To form an association of the plot holders. I am getting a draft constitution so it can be all done legally. The association would be responsible for collecting the water charges, so only plot holders willing to pay would have access. Our local water supplier can provide secured taps. Plot holders to help with any landscaping to the site for the installation. The only stumbling block is the initial outlay. Trying out the councilor again, as I am sure there must be money somewhere for community projects tucked away. Fingers crossed.  |
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Post by borderbabe on Oct 12, 2006 14:34:58 GMT
I have no water supply at the site where I have my plot. I wrote a letter to the Council in June and recieve a polite acknowledgement and a phone call from my Disctrict Councillor when I came back from holiday in July. Since then a deafening silence has decended. Perhaps they think we dont need water now its rained a bit. I think perhaps I should chase them along a bit. I'll keep you posted as to progress or lack of same.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 16, 2006 12:23:53 GMT
No water on my plot, and not any access to any either. I have rigged up guttering to fill 4 water butts from my shed roof, each is linked by a syphon, so I only need access to one to draw water. I have rigged a similar syphon hose into my greenhouse, so by lowering the hosepipe, I can water my plants in there directly.
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Post by scarecrow on Dec 10, 2006 14:13:52 GMT
Hi oldmoleskine,,,,,,,,,,, i have just got my lottie in southampton,  so i am new to allotments and messageboards, so bear with me, on my site we have water, [ and can use hosepipes ] ;D toilets and a allotment holders shop with dicount products , we are aloud to have sheds and greenhouses, most of the plots have been taken and some by young family's. it has been a lot of hard work getting it in to some sort of order, with bindweed, [roots go down a long way] . and dandelions by the ton,, I would say southampton council is one of the better one's |
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Post by oldmoleskins on Dec 10, 2006 16:40:57 GMT
welcome, scarecrow - and seeing your other posting re pics, when you 'crack' it, think about posting some of your allotment through the season in our "My Garden/Allotment" thread. You'll find it at the top of the list in "The Gallery"
OM.
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so i am new to allotments and messageboards, so bear with me, on my site we have water, [ and can use hosepipes ] ;D toilets and a allotment holders shop with dicount products , we are aloud to have sheds and greenhouses, most of the plots have been taken and some by young family's. it has been a lot of hard work getting it in to some sort of order, with bindweed, [roots go down a long way]