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Post by Jonah on Jan 31, 2007 13:31:59 GMT
Hello Plocket [or anyone else who can help me!] Can you help me with my Korean Beauty grown from seed? I have been informed they are a group one, and when I checked on Hull it said they didn't need pruning. They look as if they have died down over winter [is that right for grp. 1?] I have left the 'dead' stems alone, but now there are little buds of new growth all the way up the stems. Should I just leave them to their own devices? As you can gather I'm not a clem expert! Thanks for any advice.  |
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Post by Plocket on Jan 31, 2007 14:02:23 GMT
Hi Jonah!
Yes many group 1 clematis die back in the winter but still don't require pruning - if you do cut them back you sacrifice flowers.
It sounds as though you have nice happy healthy little plants so stop worrying! Did the seed packet give any instructions for the following year of growth (assuming that you sowed them last year)? Personally as they are young I would let them be until you have some nice fresh leaves, then cut the plant back leaving a couple of leaf nodes. That way the plant should produce new growth low down rather than concentrating on just the one stem, and the remaining leaves can sustain the plant while it produces new growth. How many plants do you have? If you have quite a few and don't have the instructions any more it might be fun to see what happens - cut a couple back as I've suggested, and leave a couple. And how big are the pots they are in?
They might well want potting up soon because clems do have quite big root systems - when you come to potting up, plant the seedlings up to the lowest leaf-node - again this will encourage basal growth and stronger plants.
I hope this helps and isn't too complicated!
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Post by Plocket on Jan 31, 2007 14:12:57 GMT
I've just checked my British Clematis Society information and they say that "young clematis should be pinched back from time to time to build up a strong root system and increase the number of stems. A year later they should be ready for planting out in the garden."
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Post by Jonah on Jan 31, 2007 15:16:15 GMT
Thanks Plocket. Umm... they are already in the garden  I can't remember if I started them last winter or last spring, but I put them out in the summer. I did have the odd flower, so I suppose they do what it says on the tin [same season if started early] The biggest one got to about 3 foot before shrivelling away, and the new shoots, from my quick glimpse, appear most of the way up. I have two in the border and two in pots left outside. How will that affect pruning, as they might be a bit bigger than you thought they were? While you are here.....  My evergreen clem Early Sensation doesn't seem as happy as it was, and as we will probably lose the tree it is growing up this year I was thinking of moving it and giving it a bit of a trim. When do you think will be a good time, I was a bit worried about affecting the flowers this spring? Sorry, I'll leave you alone now! ;D |
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Post by Plocket on Jan 31, 2007 15:38:02 GMT
Oh well if they are already in the garden you will need to decide whether you want to cut them back and make bushier plants, but that will sacrifice flowers. Personally if they are happy I would leave them, but build up a bit of soil at the bottom of the plants to encourage them to shoot from there.
Early Sensation doesn't require pruning and is a fairly tender clematis anyway, but if it does need a tidy up I would do it once you've moved it and established that it's happy. It won't particularly like being moved either but I would consider digging it up and growing it in a large container until you know where you want to grow it permanently. When you dig it up, dig as big a rootball as possible and try not to damage the roots (which is going to be difficult if it's growing up a tree) - then gently shake off some of the soil and plant it in a large pot with fresh John Innes No. 3 and some grit added in. If you have it put some potash into the mix too. Water your plant well and put it in a sheltered sunny position to give it a chance to recover. If you have an unheated or cool greenhouse you could move the plant now, but otherwise I would wait until May/after flowering.
Px
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Post by Jonah on Jan 31, 2007 15:55:27 GMT
Thanks again Plocket I might trim one of the Korean Beauty's in the ground then, and leave one alone to see what happens, and do what you say at the base. I think I will leave the early Sensation til after flowering, and do as you say with it. It has only been in the ground about two years, so hopefully it won't be too settled in yet. I've taken a cutting, though don't expect it to take, but you never know! |
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Post by Plocket on Jan 31, 2007 16:19:04 GMT
The best way to propagate clematis is by layering. When you've moved yours, tease out a stem and press leaf nodes into pots of sieved John Innes NO.3, securing them with wires or whatever. Do that along the stem and leave them for a year or so. When they look as though they are growing you can snip them off the mother plant, and lo and behold you have lots of babies! Good luck with the cutting Jonah - some clematis take more easily than others - let me know how you get on as I'm trying cuttings of mum's Pixie - they are similar.
Px
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Post by Jonah on Jan 31, 2007 16:52:15 GMT
Ok Plocket, I'll give it a go! I'll have to ask mum for a couple of hair pins! ;D
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Post by Mr Grinch on Jan 31, 2007 17:22:37 GMT
Hi Plocket, I have Clematis 'Nellie Moser' in a tub but the colors in the flowers seem to fade very quickly ? Do you know why this should be ? Can i prune this one ? Mr G  |
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Post by Plocket on Jan 31, 2007 17:31:10 GMT
Hia Mr G!
Probably because it's in the sun Mr Grinch. Move the tub to a shadier position and the colour won't fade so much.
It's a group 2 clematis so you can prune it back by about a third (max a half) after flowering - it will then produce fresh new growth for flowers the following year.
Px
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Post by Mr Grinch on Jan 31, 2007 18:21:14 GMT
Thanks Plocket, i must admit to a bit of Clematis vandalism. I cut it right back to about 6 inches this autumn. It had become so entangled i thought this would be the best option. Its also in sun so i will move it to where my 'Sunset' is at the moment. Its a bit more shadier on that side of the patio !! Mr G  |
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Post by Plocket on Jan 31, 2007 18:39:31 GMT
Gordon Bennett Mr G do you have something against clematis??? ;D I hope your Nelly is ok, and if it is you might not get many, if any, flowers this year!
Px
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Post by Mr Grinch on Jan 31, 2007 19:41:47 GMT
I must admit  to having done this before and it has flowered but much later though and with only one flush of flowers. The sun has defo made an impact on flowers, when they first open they look great but quickly fade in the heat ! Mr G |
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Post by Plocket on Feb 1, 2007 8:22:13 GMT
;D Well if you prune as recommended Mr G you will find that your Nelly is much more prolific as far as flowers are concerned! Back by a half (ok if you are feeling really vicious you could cut it back a LITTLE bit more!) immediately after it first flowers and then you should get a second flush of flowers. You can prune a little bit after this but it isn't really recommended. Give it a try and see if it makes a difference! ;D
Px
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Post by Mr Grinch on Feb 1, 2007 9:25:36 GMT
Thanks Plocket !
Mr G
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Post by fozzie on Feb 2, 2007 18:31:06 GMT
P,
whilst you're on the subject another question. As you kow I have several of your darlings growing through several of my darlings. I have a mixture of all 3 groups. Now, as the majority of my darlings never get pruned unless damaged, your darlings never go under the knife either. Am I stressing the poor things or will they survive, bearing in mind I have already murdered James Mason!
sorry to be cryptic but it looked nicer!
Fx
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Post by Plocket on Feb 2, 2007 18:47:08 GMT
Hehehe! I like it! I don't think you are stressing my darlings at all but they perform better if they are pruned as recommended. You'll find that your Group 2 "my darlings" will become top heavy as far as flowers are concerned if you don't prune them back a bit, and similarly the Group 3s. Would your darlings suffer much if you had to prune my darlings?
Px
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Post by fozzie on Feb 2, 2007 19:31:32 GMT
My darlings would not suffer. I am more concered about 'ere indoors's darling, namely me. It will call for full body armour including goggles. I know how tightly your darlings hang on! Getting all those tendrils off may be a step too far.
I will give it a go this year. I have enough troble typing now, after applying the plasters and finger-stalls it may prove impossible.
Fx
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Post by Plocket on Feb 3, 2007 9:37:01 GMT
Well I guess the key thing is that 'er indoors' darling is ok but of course my darlings and your darlings should still be nurtured. I don't know how fussy a gardener you are but personally I would do the pruning and pull as much of my darlings away from your darlings as you can whilst being careful. The Group 2 ones are going to be the harder ones to prune because they will still be alive, whereas the Group 3s have died back over winter. You could cut the Group 2 my darlings and leave the stems to die on your darlings, and then pull them away. I don't bother about the odd dead leaf on my darlings because they soon grow over the dead bits! ;D
Did any of that make sense?? ;D
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Post by fozzie on Feb 3, 2007 11:05:28 GMT
To me, total sense. Anybody else reading I'm not so sure, they possible think we are both raving. Which, speaking for myself, is possible true. As for being a "fussy" gardener. Er no. I tend to leave a lot of "home building material" lying around for those creatures that might need it in Spring. I need them on my side when fighting other little creatures like aphids and slugs.
This year I will attempt the pruning of your darlings, But I have to tell you Nelly. Alpina and Perle have been there for 4 years and not only meander through my darlings but also each other and over an arbor. I think they are different groups (?) So it could be entertaining. Like a ball of wool once the kitten has finished playing!!
Fx
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Post by Plocket on Feb 3, 2007 17:06:28 GMT
That sounds like a mixture of all three groups Fozzie, in which case you've got your work cut out: Perle (d'Azure?) is Group 3, Nelly is Group 2 and Alpinas are Group 1s. I'm not sure I'd want to take on the task but wish you luck. Let me know how you get on if/when you do the pruning ;D
I'm off to David Austin tomorrow with any luck - any recommendations for more small container-suitable roses from them?
Px
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Post by fozzie on Feb 3, 2007 22:14:28 GMT
Sorry about lateness of reply keep getting unexpected guests arriving, hence mistake on PM.
I thought you were set on Mrs Fisher, with Mr P leaning to Dusky Maiden
I'l give you a couple more in the same vein ie HTs Whire Knight, White Wings, Dainty Maid, Ellen Wilmott. You could also look at Moonbeam and Wild Flower both by DA but they vary in size.
Also looked at some Floribundas, but think they may be too "fussy" for your taste but look anyway Saga, Nearly Wild and Eye Paint.
Fx
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Post by fozzie on Feb 3, 2007 22:28:06 GMT
P.
just been looking on D A site does not seem to have any of those apart from Eye Paint iand moonbeam in stock. So my suggestions will be of no great help to you.
Sorryyyyyy
Fx
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Post by fozzie on Feb 4, 2007 10:41:40 GMT
P if your still going today make sure you wrap up, especially LP. Assuming you've got the same fine Winters' day we have.
a couple more, been asleep, so brain back in gear!! Pearl Drift-its a double flower or Jacqeline du Pre- single flower, Lyda Rose, Ballerina, Mutabilis
Have a good day out.
Fx
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Post by Plocket on Feb 4, 2007 15:36:00 GMT
Thanks Fozzie, unfortunately your suggestions came a little late, but we were dressed up warm and as it turns out it's been a glorious day!
I came back with Regenberg for me as a pot rose (I think that's the right spelling) and Sophy's Rose for LP - her choice, which we've put in the ground fairly near to Rose of Picardy. I'm now searching for roses with specific names but think we might have to visit Fryer's in Knutsford (my sister liked them - do you know them at all?) and possibly Cottage Garden Roses which isn't far from us.
Px
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Post by grannyjanny on Feb 4, 2007 20:25:35 GMT
Hi Plocket. If you go to Fryers there is another rose grower on the way. Hart's nursery, Sudlow Lane, Knutsford. It's just off Manchester Road, before the old cottage hospital which is now Poppies nursery (childrens). I've googled it & it's there. There is another called Curbishleys Roses, Aston-by Budworth. When you've done those three it might be time for lunch at Willowpool?
Janet.
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Post by Plocket on Feb 4, 2007 20:33:26 GMT
Thank you Janet - that's very thoughtful of you! I've been to Willowpool and agree that not only is it a lovely quirky place, but the food is good! My sister used to live in Knutsford hence me knowing about Fryers but I've made a note of your other recommendations too. I'm actually looking for roses with names that are sentimental to me but am not yet ready to post those names - the more places for me to check out the better!
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Post by grannyjanny on Feb 5, 2007 22:23:27 GMT
That's OK Plocket. I am a Knutsfordian as is my husband & 2 of my daughters, the youngest is a Mancunian, she was a month early (weighed 7lds 2ozs), so could't be born at the local maternity hospital.
Where did your sister live. Is this the sister who went to Australia?
Janet.
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Post by Plocket on Feb 6, 2007 18:51:40 GMT
She lived on Mobberley Road I think - it was a few years ago now! Then she moved to a little village fairly close by, and now she's in New Zealand, not Oz! Her kids are Mancs though they don't sound it now!!! ;D
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I can't remember if I started them last winter or last spring, but I put them out in the summer. I did have the odd flower, so I suppose they do what it says on the tin [same season if started early] The biggest one got to about 3 foot before shrivelling away, and the new shoots, from my quick glimpse, appear most of the way up. I have two in the border and two in pots left outside. How will that affect pruning, as they might be a bit bigger than you thought they were?
