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Post by Cheerypeabrain on Sept 30, 2006 17:59:55 GMT
I've only been taking this gardening lark seriously for a few years..and one thing I've never really got to grips with is taking and keeping cuttings. I've done the bog-basic fuchsia and geranium ones at this time of year, but by about Feb they always look really pathetic and leggy (if not crispy!) I'm obviously doing something wrong. I use the recommended mix and don't overwater...they always end up having to be chucked away.
I get along fine with spring cuttings taken from dahlias, it's just this time of year, any advice? (I've not tried sowing at this time of year either)
This year I have a new CF and apparently the cuttings (and snails) will like it in there.....
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Post by andy on Sept 30, 2006 18:37:18 GMT
I think the problems that you get with both geranium and fuchsia cuttings is keeping them dry but ticking over. They need to be cool with good airflow around the pots to keep any grey mould or blackleg diseases away. A spray with a fungicide might help. If you can keep the pots off the ground on a wire frame work, that might help with getting better airflow.
Depending on the fuchsia variety, they might be deciduous and drop their leaves anyway. Fuchsias always do better in my experience when taken as softwood cuttings around May time.
In a few months, it will be time to take hardwood cuttings.....many species of shrub can be easily taken this way and no greenhouse is needed either. Seeds from trees and shrubs can also be collected soon ready for stratifying (subjected to cold treatment).
We need a propagation section on here
Hope this helps a bit
Andy
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Post by Deleted on Sept 30, 2006 18:51:53 GMT
i've never been much cop at taking cuttings either, apart from things you can stick in a glass of water and watch the roots grow. I'm currently got 5 sprigs from my lavender bush and some fuschia cuttings going. I'm just trying to keep them fairly warm (well not cold) and not watering them too much. I hope that they may have taken hold by the time the really cold stuff start. I must admit to not really knowing what the right mix should be although i have used seed compost rather than multi. my one major success was to grow african violets from a couple of leaf cuttings. it took 4eva but finally i managed to get wee baby leaves and it's still going strong now. no flowers on that one this year though. i don't even like african violets much, but these have sentimental value!  |
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Post by Cheerypeabrain on Sept 30, 2006 19:01:49 GMT
Thank you Andy & mrskp...you are right Andy, a propagation section would be v useful....and I use cheshunt compound when I sow my seeds would that be used when taking cuttings too ?(my sister and I went halves on the pack as it was expensive, I just got mine in a tupperware...she's got the packet!)
I may just concentrate on getting my tender plants through the winter. As for the fuschas....well at our local cheapie GC we can get 2 for £1 in the spring...so nae botha....
I would like to become a more proficient gardener tho...with knowledge of how to do these interesting things even if I never do them. I would love to do the basic horticulture course at Brooksby like my sister has...but I have to go to work.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 30, 2006 19:06:56 GMT
i keep meaning to look for an evening class, but this is in a city where you eat your young ! gardening hasn't really caught on yet !
I'd be very interested in a propogation section. everything i do is very hit and miss and sometimes i just get lucky!
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Post by Alicat on Sept 30, 2006 19:23:35 GMT
 Me too, I would love a propogation section.. I have hit and miss Occasions with cuttings. geraniums, penstemons, rosemary, laveteria, Flaming Katie, ( sorry all common names.) Some bushes also, I can do. Fuchsia & clematis I struggle with. I do have a green house. But some winters I can still loose things Especially if it's a cold winter. This year I intend to fleece my plants, and bring the special ones in. Holding my breath. Alicat.
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Post by chickadeedeedee on Oct 1, 2006 2:01:55 GMT
Hmmmmm. I pull the dahlias, fuschia, geraniums and others out of the ground and shake the soil from their roots in the fall. They are then placed in a tray filled with pine shavings and stored over winter in low to moderate light and normal room temperatures. They remain dormant until spring. In the spring when they start to send out new growth, they get potted in their own containers in real soil and then out to the garden when the weather warms up.
Cuttings have rarely grown for me other than brugmansia.
Chick a DDD
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Post by andy on Oct 1, 2006 8:45:13 GMT
There are many secrets to success with cuttings and it all depends on the species of plant you are propagating.
The biggest problem is water loss from the cutting. This is one of the reasons why we remove so many leaves when taking a cutting.....plants lose water from their leaves in a similar way that we sweat. By removing up to 90% of the leaves, water loss is reduced to a minimum.
Keeping the cutting in a very humid environment such as a sealed plastic bag or purpose built propagator reduces the problem even further. A daily mist with water is helpful.....or using a mist propagator is ideal if you have the space and money !!!
Heat is another essental factor.....and bottom heat is well known to promote root growth on cuttings.
Unfortunatly, warmth and moisture are ideal breeding grounds for fungal and bacterial diseases, especially grey mould (botrytis). Therefore, it is essential to maintain good airflow around the cuttings and their containers. Small electic fans are useful for this......computer fans are ideal and will go a long way to ensure the cutting remains disease free.
Once rooted, cuttings are able to support themselves by taking up water by their newly formed roots. A mist unit or even a sealed bad is not necessary at this point on although both bottom heat and air movement are still advantitious.
Always remove dead or dying leaves and cuttings that have died off as these are perfect breeding grounds for fungal diseases.
Once rooted, allow the cuttings to start growing and, if growing well, maybe provide a dilute liquid feed as the soil they are in is still cuttings compost which will have very little in the way of nutrients. Once the cuttings are doing ok.....you will usually know a few weeks after they've rooted if they're ok, they can be potted.
Overwintering the cuttings should preferably be done in a cool greenhouse or conservatory. A min temp of 10 deg c should suffice and watering should be kept to a minimum. There should be a space around each pot again to allow air movement and stop diseases occuring.
Don't forget that even with temperatures over 10 c, some deciduous shrubs might still lose their leaves so don't think the cutting is dead.
Hope this helps a bit !!!
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2006 9:09:05 GMT
i've got my lavender in 3" pots with a sandy/seed mix, and put the propogator cover on at night, taking it off during the day. The fuchsias seem to be doing ok cos they're budding - they don't get a cover. should i remove them to let them concentrate on beefing up the roots ? (i guess that's a common sense question really) i've got some other bush cuttings (haven't a clue as to the variety but is common as muck up here - silvery smooth oval leave, yellow flowers) and they don't seem to have rooted at all. if i gave the cutting a tug, it would just come straight back out of the soil. may bring those in and stick them in the heated propogator for a bit. This is the reason that i want to start and keep a detailed diary, i stole the original bit of bush from work last year and that has come on leaps and bounds, but what i did to get it this far, i haven't a clue.  thanks for your help andy, i'll be reading your stuff with interest. |
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Post by andy on Oct 1, 2006 9:25:31 GMT
Propagation is a fantastic subject and i was lucky enough to be propagator for Brighton parks department for a couple of years.
Your silvery leaf plants sounds like senecio greyii....which i think has now been renamed (bryoglotis or something). They will appreciate some heat to kick start the rooting and if you can provide bottom heat, all the better.
As with most things horticultural, propagation is a matter of trial and error and a log of what you done and when is a good idea. Try different methods, different soils, with or without rooting hormone etc etc. Don't forget about the virtues of rooting cuttings in pure pearlite either.
It would be nice to have a propagation section as there's always cuttings or seeds that can be done throughout the year.
Andy
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2006 9:40:21 GMT
spot on Andy, thanks for that, i can give it a label now. funny thing when i googled it came up with "widely known for its drought tolerance". Couldn't get further from drought up here ! i forgot, i've also grown this little baby from a cutting a couple of years ago. nearly killed it this year due to overwatering and inadequate drainage. Thankfully it's comeback now but is in need of a haircut. i'll definitely take more detailed notes of how i do things in future. what's the difference between pearlite and vermiculite ? i often put vermiculite over seeds for germination and to give the compost a bit of airiness but have never really known why lol.  |
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Post by Cheerypeabrain on Oct 1, 2006 13:08:42 GMT
I lost all my dahlia tubers last year despite lifting them, draining them on newspaper and storing them in vermiculite..I'm afraid they got damp and all rotted (my own fault) I'm now in a quandry as to whether to leave them in the ground this year. I don't really have anywhere to keep them dry...OH is reluctant to let me use his garage! (wouldn't they get damp in there as well?)
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2006 13:59:47 GMT
I agree with others, a propagation board would be great (sorry mods, I know we're always whingeing about too many boards  ... but in this case ...) ... cheers ... |
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Post by beejay on Oct 1, 2006 14:57:45 GMT
I think that it is quite important for things like pelargonium cuttings that you have taken in the late summer time to have the growing tip pinched out once they have rooted & perhaps been potted on. This would then help stop them getting too leggy over the winter.
Why can't propogation questions be asked/answered on a general board or specific plant type on the board we have cuerrently?
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Post by andy on Oct 1, 2006 16:01:24 GMT
Well i can't really argue too much as i'm a newcomer on here. But propagation is a pretty specialised section to horticulture and there's always some kind of cutting to take or seed to sow. I must admit that i was surprised not to see a section.
It's the same as saying "why isn't the clematis section in with the shrubs" or "why can't it be called the climbers section" etc
There will always be people who agree and disagree but from a personal point of view, a propagation section would be very interesting and useful.
IMHO of course !!!
Andy
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Post by Alicat on Oct 1, 2006 16:31:24 GMT
PM Rosefriend. Ps. Wasn't sure who to post it to.
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Post by sweetleaf on Oct 1, 2006 16:35:10 GMT
Id like a propagation section, and if its possible to make it like a diary ie plants to propagate this month, that would be fab...memory is rubbish these days and Im always "missing the starting gun" so to speak! Sorry to be a pest boss, but can it be done...pretty please?  |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2006 17:21:25 GMT
Thank you so much for that clear information Andy, it will be very helpful. I also think a propagation section would be a good idea, mainly because I refer to books all the time but seem to spend more time reading than doing. I would really like a nudge at the appropriate time. Maybe if we just headed our query with ''propagation'' in the title and then see how we go on solving the problems...  At least the threads would be easier to spot then. Well... just a thought. W x |
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Post by Alicat on Oct 3, 2006 19:19:04 GMT
Id like a propagation section, and if its possible to make it like a diary ie plants to propagate this month, that would be fab...memory is rubbish these days and Im always "missing the starting gun" so to speak! Sorry to be a pest boss, but can it be done...pretty please? Are you still having trouble with your marbles. |
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Post by Alicat on Oct 4, 2006 18:45:09 GMT
There are many secrets to success with cuttings and it all depends on the species of plant you are propagating. The biggest problem is water loss from the cutting. This is one of the reasons why we remove so many leaves when taking a cutting.....plants lose water from their leaves in a similar way that we sweat. By removing up to 90% of the leaves, water loss is reduced to a minimum. Keeping the cutting in a very humid environment such as a sealed plastic bag or purpose built propagator reduces the problem even further. A daily mist with water is helpful.....or using a mist propagator is ideal if you have the space and money !!! Heat is another essental factor.....and bottom heat is well known to promote root growth on cuttings. Unfortunatly, warmth and moisture are ideal breeding grounds for fungal and bacterial diseases, especially grey mould (botrytis). Therefore, it is essential to maintain good airflow around the cuttings and their containers. Small electic fans are useful for this......computer fans are ideal and will go a long way to ensure the cutting remains disease free. Once rooted, cuttings are able to support themselves by taking up water by their newly formed roots. A mist unit or even a sealed bad is not necessary at this point on although both bottom heat and air movement are still advantitious. Always remove dead or dying leaves and cuttings that have died off as these are perfect breeding grounds for fungal diseases. Once rooted, allow the cuttings to start growing and, if growing well, maybe provide a dilute liquid feed as the soil they are in is still cuttings compost which will have very little in the way of nutrients. Once the cuttings are doing ok.....you will usually know a few weeks after they've rooted if they're ok, they can be potted. Overwintering the cuttings should preferably be done in a cool greenhouse or conservatory. A min temp of 10 deg c should suffice and watering should be kept to a minimum. There should be a space around each pot again to allow air movement and stop diseases occuring. Don't forget that even with temperatures over 10 c, some deciduous shrubs might still lose their leaves so don't think the cutting is dead. Hope this helps a bit !!! Thanks Andy. I have copied and filed this for future reference. Keep the info coming. Alicat. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2006 19:09:57 GMT
Me too
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Post by andy on Oct 4, 2006 20:05:07 GMT
It'll be time for hardwood cuttings soon and for collecting tree seeds for stratifying (cold treatment)
If it's ok with the bosses, i will do a step by step with photos...as long as it don't take up too much bandwidth.
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Post by oldmoleskins on Oct 4, 2006 20:09:48 GMT
Put it in " in the greenhouse" andy - that'll be where the propagation section will be, and that way all bookmarks will be valid - no move involved!!
OM.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2006 20:36:25 GMT
Oh yes please...!
I can't get in very often, but will watch out for the thread in the Greenhouse.
Thanks
Wx
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2006 20:43:23 GMT
Bill and Kate were talking about collecting tree seeds on autumn watch tonight. i'll definitely look out for the instructions !
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Post by Alicat on Oct 4, 2006 21:13:58 GMT
Sounds good to me.! Will keep my eyes open. Bill & Kate.? mrskp. Alicat.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2006 21:37:19 GMT
Autumn Watch - Oddie and Humble !
;D
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Post by Alicat on Oct 4, 2006 21:57:54 GMT
;D
Now I'm with YOU.
I don't get to watch much T.V.
Alicat.
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Post by Dutchy on Oct 5, 2006 7:58:25 GMT
Andy thanks for that info.
Have you got advice on how to propagate a Passionflower. There still are flower buds on every branch and I do want to have this one next year. I will cut it back and try to overwinter it on a window sill but I would like to have more. Hence the cutting question ;D.
Help...
Dutchy
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Post by andy on Oct 5, 2006 8:24:07 GMT
Hi Dutchy Passiflora are one of the easier shrubs/climbers to take cutting off. Get one long stem and basically cut it up into either nodal or inter-nodal cuttings. At the top of each cutting, there must be a leaf node and a pair of leaves. Remove any flower buds and tendrils. At the bottom can either be another leaf node with the leaves removed or just a bare stem.....the cutting will root from either types Hopefully this quick diagram which i just knocked up in paint will be of use.  |
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... but in this case ...) ... cheers ...
At least the threads would be easier to spot then. Well... just a thought.
