What would you do ?

[Tig]

See your point FA - stuck between a rock and a hard place really

Do you know if he is doing any work for other people? It would give you an idea if he has got some cashflow? Does he still advertise in local papers? Get someone else to ring him up with a 'job' and see if he can fit them in - just a thought?

[JennyWrenn]

I have been checking this Thread and hoping you would get your money back - good idea of Tiggy's

My friend put a huge banner up in his garden that could be seen from the road about a builder owing him money - he was paid quite quickly - but I am not sure now if this is legal

This was many years ago

If he is a limited company he can go bankrupt and you wont get anything but if not then you can claim from his personal assets ie "trading as" etc

[Deleted]

He's not a Ltd Co, he's a sole trader. If he goes bankrupt, we can claim off his assets but we would be only one of his creditors and therefore we'd have to wait in line. We don't want to go down that route but he's lied to us and now is not answering his phone to us.

It's going to end up in County Court and if we get a judgement against him, we may have to employ a debt collection agency to seize assets to the value of what he owes us.

FA x

[JennyWrenn]

If he's Limited then other companies ie Tax, VAT will get preference
But as a sole trader you can claim so let us hope you can get some compo

I am so sorry it must be a nightmare

[Deleted]

The wife of one of my colleagues is a solicitor. She only deals with divorces, not litigation so I can't use her services but she has recommended someone she knows that I could speak to over this money.

They are going to have a word with him tonight on my behalf and then let me know what he says. They are also going to find out if he would be willing to take the case on and how much it would cost me to get a solicitor's letter issued to the T**t builder. I think it may be worth investing £150 or so in seeking his advice because then I would have a much better understanding of what would be involved and what my chances of getting anything back are.

I've also spoken to vodafone. I called the builder on my mobile on 6 July to call the job off and he agreed in that call to refund the money to me. I've asked Vodafone for recordings of the call or official transcripts so that if the need arises, I can produce them in court. They are going to look into it and let me know if they can do it - fortunately my itemised bill provided the exact time and duration of the call to his number so I could pinpoint exactly which call it was I wanted.

It's all a bloody nightmare to be honest. Even Mrs FA, one of the most placid people going, is absolutely steaming that he won't give us the money back and just about ready to rip someone's head off. If I'm not around much in the future, you'll know why........ ;D

FA x

[oldmoleskins]

FA, I've only just seen this tale of woe and have every sympathy. Go for him without delay.

I've dealt with 'small builders' all my working life and have had mercifully few experiences of bad 'uns, but where I did and they were sole traders with reputations and perhaps more importantly, assets, they have generally reached an accommodation out of court for fear of the bad publicity and/or additional financial loss. In one case the guy was frightened to tell his wife - so I did, to get that block out of the way. She paid up and gave him hell.

The biggest problem you've identified - he may not have the money in 'cash' anymore. He may have assets. It may not be a matter of bankruptcy but a bank loan or second mortgage for him as a way out. If that's the case, then sorry to say it's a slow process - and you must start now to get some of these 'mays' resolved. £150 to start the process formally is an additional pain, but it sounds like the only way forward... you've been patient - and now you're being juggled with.

OM.

[Deleted]

Mrs FA phoned him this morning. He hung up then refused to answer the phone when she tried again (mind you, she did try 10 times..... ;D).

I've been given the name of a good solicitor and will be speaking to her this afternoon. Hopefully a solicitor's letter and the threat of bad publicity will be enough to prod him in the right direction. If not, I am gunning for the with all guns blazing.

FA x

[Shrubrose]

Hi FA, what was the solicitor's advice? Hope it was helpful?

[Deleted]

Hi Shrub

I've got a meeting with her on Friday. She's going to write him a letter threatening County Court action etc and give him 7 days to pay up. If he doesn't, it will be up to me to take it to County Court. She will do that for me but as it's going to cost me £170 for a letter to be issued, I can't afford to use her services for all that CC entails so I'll have to do it myself.

Spoke to Vodafone today as well. They can't supply a recording of the call, unfortunately. Ho hum, it would have been nice but 'twas not to be. We'll just have to carry on without.

FA x

[Plocket]

Keep your chin up Fat Andy - you've got a lot of support here and hopefully the Courts will do the same.

Px

[Shrubrose]

I'm sure you can get some good advice/support FA from Citizen's Advice Bureau on taking small claims through the CC. Have you tried them yet? Might be worth a shot.

I really cant believe the bare-faced cheek of the man. If his reputation's all he's got then you've grounds to smear it. And on that matter, can Trading Standards help? Is he registered with the Builder's Federation? Plucking at straws here FA but again, might be worth doing a bit of research if it'll support your case?

[Deleted]

I've done CAB. They advised me to write to him, setting out dates and times of what was agreed, which I've done. It didn't make any difference. My solicitor will be writing to him in the next few days giving him 7 days to pay up or face court action. If nothing else, it may concentrate his mind.

As for smearing his reputation, everyone I know has been told about him and what he's done and been asked to pass it on to everyone they know in conversation. I've got quite a few contacts in the building trade through my days playing footie and I've made sure they all know who he is and what he's done. Word will get around that he's untrustworthy and if nothing else, he might find it harder to get work in this area for a while. Although that doesn't help me get my money back any quicker, it does give me a little sense of satisfaction to know I might piss him off a bit.

FA x

[Plocket]

Well that's a bit of a "hurrah" for you FA.

I know you don't go this far, but where I used to live in Beckenham a bloke was badly treated by a local double glazing company. As it turned out he ran a little advertising business and had vans that towed adverts on trailers around town. He made up a trailer saying how bad this double glazing company was and towed them around town so everyone could see. Eventually the double glazing company tried to sue the bloke but he won because he prooved that they were taking the piss.

Keep us posted with your progress FA, and I'm sure that justice will prevail.

Px

[Shrubrose]

My finger's are crossed for you FA. Keep us posted as to how you get on.

[Deleted]

Brief update. My solicitor's letter produced no response (surprise surprise : so I now have to go through the hassle of going to court. I'll be downloading the forms and getting it off to court in the next few days. Ho hum.

FA x

[Jasmine]

Good luck FB - it sounds as though he is calling your bluff at the moment so keep at it.

[Barbara]

he is probably hoping youll get fed up andy, so DON'T

[farmersboy]

Oct 8, 2008 18:27:35 GMT Jasmine said:

Good luck FB - it sounds as though he is calling your bluff at the moment so keep at it.

FB,dont you mean FA,Jas ;D

[Tig]

Don't forget to add interest and out-of-pocket expenses to the original sum outstanding if you have to quote the value of your claim FA

Good luck

x Tig

[Deleted]

Don't worry Tig. I will be adding the £225 it costs to get it into court in the first place and the £184 it cost to get my solicitor to write him a letter to my claim.

I have now found out through my solicitor that he jointly owns his house with his wife. If I get a court judgement in my favour and he doesn't pay it, I can get a charging order put on his house so that when the house is sold, I will get my money. It's not ideal because he might not sell it for 25 years but it would guarantee something at some point !

FA x

[Plocket]

Well as you say FA that's better than nothing. Keep your chin up love

[Barbara]

I would be stamping and banging about, all over the place, and all over his as well.

[oldmoleskins]

Oct 8, 2008 19:50:47 GMT @fatandy said:

... It's not ideal because he might not sell it for 25 years but it would guarantee something at some point !

FA x

Look on the bright side: it will appear as a charge if he should ever want to raise cash by remortgaging, FA. Chances are you're owed less than he might seek to raise, so it would make sense to pay you off to ease his application's chances. That might be sooner than a move, especially in these straitened times...

OM.

[Deleted]

More news......I had a call from my solicitor today. The builder has appointed a solicitor to act on his behalf. Although this might at first not seem like great news because it might mean he wants to fight me for the money, I am taking it as a positive sign. It shows that he is taking us seriously and he is no longer ignoring us. It also means that things have moved forward and that the matter may be a little closer to a resolution.

We don't know yet what his stance is going to be. My guess is that he will try to keep all of the money somehow (he will probably try and claim it was a non-refundable deposit or that he lost "x" number of weeks work or something). All we know is that he has appointed a solicitor and that they will be responding in full "shortly". They also asked us to confirm that legal action had not been commenced, which it hasn't.

I've asked them (via my solicitor) to respond to me direct at this stage. My solicitor is lovely but charges £145 an hour so I'm going to wait and see what his solicitor says before deciding how to respond. If he is using a solicitor, it will be costing him money too so hopefully, I may be able to use that as leverage to try and cut a deal for a refund of some of my money.

Up until today, I was pretty fed up with this whole thing but now I'm more positive. Even if he says he's not going to pay us anything, we will at least know his position and can deal with it. It also brings the prospect of a resolution of this bloody matter a little bit closer.

FA x

[Tig]

£145 an hour Goodness we should have studied law FA

Glad you feel more positive

x Tig

[Shrubrose]

Well, at least you've had a response from him FA. He's taking you seriously and that's good. I'm still hoping you get a happy ending.

[Deleted]

So much for me being "more positive". The solicitor acting on behalf of the f*****g low life scumbag of a builder finally put pen to paper and wrote to us today.

They are claiming that not only should their client keep the £8000 but that he is entitled to another £10000 for loss of earnings etc. However, if we are willing to take it no further, their client is willing to leave it at £8000, which he will duly keep. That's really good of him isn't it. What an absolute c***. I don't know how he can f*****g sleep at night.

I'm so f*****g angry, Mrs FA has hiden the car keys to stop me going round his house and ripping his f*****g head off.

I'll be printing off the letter and going to see my solicitor as soon as I possibly can next week. Believe me, I am now so f*****g annoyed, I'll spend another £8000 just to get my f*****g money back.

Sorry for the swearing.

FA x

[Tig]

Flipping 'eck FA - that takes the biscuit

Good that you have kept a record of events, I think he would be laughed out of court personally

He has done nothing so how can he justify that claim! Has he just sat on his backside and done nothing during the period, if so that is his choice not yours! How about asking Citizens Advice for an opinion?

Group hug of support for you and the Missus!



x Tig

[Deleted]

Thanks Tig

I can actually pick holes in the solicitor's letter myself, so I'm hoping that my solicitor will be able to rip it to shreds.

For example, he said that he "engaged subcontractors for the 10 - 12 week period the work was due to take". Does he seriously think I'm stupid enough to accept that he paid people for 10-12 weeks when they weren't doing the job ? I know for a fact that he was working again within a week. He probably paid them for other jobs he was doing at the time.

He also says he incurred costs on bricks, skip hire etc but they haven't provided any costings or documentary evidence in support.

They say we had a contract from the date the work was agreed but as we didn't have confirmation that we were being offered the additional funds until the day we went on holiday, and we didn't confirm with him that we had the money until after we got back off holiday, the contract was not confirmed until 30 June and we called the job off on 6 July. Legally, under the Consumer Credit Act, there has to be a minimum of 7 working days "cooling off" period on contracts for the provision of services and if the contract is cancelled in that time, they money should be refunded.

He's trying it on in the hope that we'll go away and leave him to enjoy my £8000. Well, as far as I'm concerned, I now want him not only to pay the £8000 but my costs and compensation for my bloody high blood pressure. I'm going to fight him every step of the way and I'm not going to give up until I see the b@st*rd in court or I make him give me the money back.

FA x

[Tig]

Sounds like you have a good argument against him there FA - a calm and logical approach will serve you well in the battle ahead - getting worked up won't get you your money back, neither will thumping him (although if I were in your position I think it would make me feel better - but that feeling wouldn't last when I ended up in court on an assault charge!)

Right should be on your side in this, if you didn't have a written contract with stated T & C's regarding deposits, cancellation charges, etc he and his solicitor are making it up as they go along. We are told enough times on Watchdog not to pay builders up front, and this is a good example of why!

x Tig