winter care

[Barbara]

In my little pond I have a Lobelia, its a marginal so it stands on a brick,do I need to take it out in the winter, and if so, where do I keep it, any advice would be most welcome, and I have either a frog or a toad I'm not sure which, does he stay around in the cold days or go looking for shelter.

[andy]

Amphibians will tend to wonder off, dig in somewhere sheltered and almost hibernate for the winter and then emerge in february ready for spawning.

As for your Lobelia, they tend to do better if the crowns of the plant is 4-6" under water to stop the frost getting to them. They seem to fair pretty well like this however, i've left them so the crowns are just above or even level with the water surface in the past and they've been fine.

[Barbara]

Thanks Andy, I saw a frog house for sale at weekend, and that was what set me off thinking.

[snowowl]

You are a kind soul Barbara i have never seen a frog house in any of the GC.
I have a froggy in my pond its well hidden but hes been inthere all summer.
I also have some tadpoles that never developed into frogs.
What happens to them over winter?

[cjhomebird]

I am always curious as to what happens to the tadpoles. And I was fooled into thinking I only had one or two frogs in my pond....until we emptied it, there were more than 50, all shapes and sizes and colours. Amazing!!

as for the plants, can anyone tell me if the lobelia is ok for a bog garden???

[Dutchy]

A Ping to ask if all have their ponds ready for Winter.
Or what actions people are taking to protect things or like me do nothing and see where Nature takes things.

I have no fish so I can afford to be more careless.

The Newts will have gone into safe areas by now and most frogs are under the mill stone I use at the top of the brooklet as a fountain.
I switched it off and the mud underneath is always apreceated by Mr and Mrs Frog and Toad.
At MssK I have a broken cat litter box upside down filled with leaves for them.
But that is nought to do with ponds in general ;D

[Deleted]

The only thing i do is to make sure theres a ball of somekind floating on the surface so the gases can evaporate. I was given 3 tadpoles last year and have seen 1 frog so it will be interesting to see if we have any spawn next year

[Chuckles]

I popped a 1" thick sheet of polystyrene over about a third of the water area of my pond today, it does keep the surface ice free as long as temps don't go really really low. We have -3 tonight so I might get a very very thin layer of ice but it's easily opened up with a drop of warm water.

[Dutchy]

Good thinking that drop of warm water. Poor creatures in the water tend to die of shock if you hack your way through the ice.
I had a layer of 60 cm of ice in the pond last year and I wonder if a ball or a sheet of polystyrene would be of any help.
But then not much is likely to work under those conditions.
Has any one ever tried a bundle of reed upright in the pond?
Does that work?

[Chuckles]

Did you try the bundle of reed last year Dutchy. I've got my usual polystyrene sheet out ready for when its needed.

[Dutchy]

No I did not.
I have this Japanese knot wood growing in there and that helps with little frost but what we got last year had the pond frozen down to its full 80 cm depth.
When after months it finally defrosted the old waterlily floated up in an ice lumb roots and all and turned over.
It had literally keeled over.
I am so not going to get live creatures in the pond. It is not deep enough.
The newts overwintered under the spare wood stack as we discovered in Spring.
So there is a new spare wood stack which I hope OH can leave alone.
The frogs are most likely under the mill stone once more and there are extra hide holes under the thick layer of Ivy hedge. They will have to fight for pride of place with the hedgehog though ;D

[Chuckles]

The thought of a frog and a hedgehog fighting sooooooo made me laugh Dutchy ;D At least your wildlife have alternative accomodation

I've just been out and checked my pond for the third day in a row. The polystyrene has been doing its job and the ice has been thin enough for me to break it by just poking it with my fingers. Today it was so thick I had to use 2 ketttles of boiling water to melt a circle the size of a dinner plate. I've now covered it over with the polystyrene again.

Bit worried as I only saw one of my two fish, lets hope the other is ok and was hiding deeper. I did lose all my fish one bad winter a few years ago, 6 of them frozen solid on the surface

[Dutchy]

Not sure if you need to do this again Chuckles.
After all you add warm water and might get the fish out of their half hibernation.
The "wild" fish also survive under a thick layer of ice and goldfish are from cold regions so they should manage unless the pond freezes all the way down.

[Chuckles]

Despite my efforts I've been unable to keep even a small area of the pond unfrozen during this last freeze. After todays inspection I could see both fish, however one was on its side and definately frozen solid in the ice about 2" from the surface. The other was very still and looked lower down, when I checked later it had gone so must be alive. After trying to melt a single hole through the ice I gave up after finding it was over 4" thick

If the poor thing is still alive after it thaws I think I'll find it a new home and I'll just keep the pond for wildlife.

[Dutchy]

That might be the best idea.
Fish do tend to sort of hibernate and not need much oxygen. As long as there are not too many rotting leaves on the bottom you might find it happy as can be this Spring.
But a deeper pond would be better.

[snowowl]

Hows everyones fish doing after the hard temps we have had.?
My sister has got some realy large Koi over 40 years old in her pond and she has had major problems.
Her pump burst and she lost a lot of water she couldnt top it up either because of the layer of ice on top.
Her fountain broke in the frost and toppled over so she had to leave it till the ice has melted.
She darent think what has happened to the fish.
My wildlife pond i have never seen so bad it is so deep in ice i cant even thaw any hole in it.
Theres a poor dead frog that must have tried to climb out but is not set in ice.
I cant get it out till it thaws.
Why did it stay in the pond over winter i wonder.

[Chuckles]

Oh dear that doesn't sound good SO. I've already posted about mine SO, last couple of posts before yours, the only thing I can now add is my one remaing fish is a gonna, found it yesterday.

The only others that I recall having fish are Andy and Ruthie, both Koi. Andy let all his go but I think Ruthie still has hers. There may be others that keep fish though.

You'll have to let us know how it goes with your sisters fish.

[snowowl]

Jan 2, 2011 10:24:41 GMT Chuckles said:

Oh dear that doesn't sound good SO. I've already posted about mine SO, last couple of posts before yours, the only thing I can now add is my one remaing fish is a gonna, found it yesterday.

The only others that I recall having fish are Andy and Ruthie, both Koi. Andy let all his go but I think Ruthie still has hers. There may be others that keep fish though.

You'll have to let us know how it goes with your sisters fish.

Sorry Chuckles i should have read back further.What a shame aboutyourfish its been so bad this year i know a freind who has also lost all his Koi.
What can you do i221.photobucket.com/albums/dd161/GWDAdmin1/Smilies/Default/sad.gif

[Dutchy]

What is done is done but maybe next year get a big inside tank.
I remember my aunt used to fish all her goldfish out of the pond and kept them in a warmish indoor tank.
It was necessary in those days. Maybe we got spoiled and colder temps are upon us for a while making investing in a good indoor tank worth while. I am not sure how one would get big fish like Koi in though

[snowowl]

Had to net out another 3 dead frogs today thats 4 intotal since january.
I dont know why they all stayed in the pond over winter.
I couldnt see them all at first till the water began to clear i turn the pump of overwinter because theres no fish in there.

[snowowl]

Well after finding 5 dead frogs after the harsh winter .
Yipee there are 2 live ones in there.
All is not lost.

[Chuckles]

What brill news SO. I hope I've got frogs in mine, will have to have a nosey about I always had frogs when the pond was in its previous home, not seen any since I moved it.

[beanie]

We have decided to fill in the pond and build a raised one nearer the house. when draining the old one we found four fish two toads and one newt.The heron had taken all the Koi despite a net. all I need now is 2-3 tons off top soil. not looking forward to moving that lot

[Dutchy]

;D You 'll manage.... to find some one to do it for you
Big job never the less Beanie.
Snowowl good news. Funny I do have frogs but they never stay in the pond during Winter.
They come back in May. The newts have the pond as their honeymoon hotel and the frogs never even try to get their eggs in.
I had toad eggs once but they too prefer the ditch.

[snowowl]

I was out doing some weeding today when there was such a racket in my pond.
I saw at least 7 frogs all doing what froggies do at this time of year and now i have 3 loads of spawn.
I sat watching them for 2 hours in the sunshine it was amazing.
I dont were they all came from but im pleased they did. ;D

[Ladygardener]

Wow how fab was that Snowowl. Lucky you.

[Auricula]

How super, Snowy - love the new avatar too

[Ladygardener]

Yes it's cute Snowowl ;D

[Dutchy]

Just a quick reminder.
If your pond is not only frozen over but also covered with snow do use a broom to remove the snow. This will let light into the pond so that oxygenating plants can continue to produce oxygen. This will hopefully stop all overwintering frogs from dying under the ice and might be good for your fish too.