rebuilding the veggie beds

[4pygmies]

I've been out today in my sadly wrecked and weed infested veggie garden. I divided it up into 6 raised beds several years ago and put down weed suppressing fabric covered with bark in between the beds. It looked good for a year or two but gradually the weeds have crept back over the paths and the bodged up beds have started to collapse. I can't afford to build new beds (although I could bodge up another lot!) and with the horrendously hot summers we get these days I am wondering whether to revert back to an old fashioned allotment type system. Last summer I spent hours watering (we have a bore hole so it was my water).
I have one bed with asparagus which is due for its first cut this year but the rest of it could be dismantled pretty quickly. I have a huge couch grass problem so I need to be able to dig it regularly really. What does everyone find are the advantage of having raised beds ? Is it any better than the old fashioned/straight lines sort of growing? I can't decide!

[Deleted]

I think it's more helpful to think about what's required for 'growing areas' and 'walking areas' - rather than 'beds' or 'paths'.

We have growing areas 1m wide. This makes them reachable to the middle for sowing and harvesting, handy for standard cloches, measuring out planting plans and yield, never trodden on, and well fed, manured and topdressed.

On our two plots, it makes sense to divide these into beds of about 4m wide so you don't have to walk too far to move around from one side to the other. The long, straight paths up the allotment are 1m wide, and the shorter paths dividing one bed from another can vary from .5m to .75m, depending on what I'm growing on the beds.



We don't edge the growing areas. Slug hotels, rottable, inflexible, tricky to weed if infested with cooch, dangerous to fall on or trip over, expensive and hard to maintain - in my view!

If you enjoy perennial veg (e.g. artichokes or asparagus) these can be planted in longer rows with narrower paths, because they require little time and attention to grow or harvest. And they make a pretty, edible hedge or windbreak.



The magic bit, discovered by accident last year, is mulching.

Topsoil from walking areas was scraped up and put onto the growing areas; black woven plastic 1m wide laid down on the subsoil; and covered with a good 8" of woodchips (free from our local council) to bring the level up to just below the growing areas. We laid down black plastic mulch around the whole plot, to prevent encroachment by cooch from the communal paths and neighbours' plots (see left of bed in pic).



In narrower walking strips between beds, we laid down thick newspaper and covered with straw.



For preparing uncultivated areas (e.g. infested with cooch, dock etc.) we laid cardboard, covered it with organic material and manure, covered that with black plastic, and got crops of spuds, squash, leeks, and brassica whilst the ground was clearing in its first year. When the black plastic comes up with the crop, you'll be able to take up 'nests' of frustrated perennial roots. It's possible to repeat the treatment if you want, for as many years as you want, but we have found that heavy and regular mulching suppresses weeds after the first year.

We mulch all the growing areas thickly with whatever organic material is easy to get and move around, preferably free or cheap. This keeps the worms busy taking nutrients into the soil, and apart from a few perennial weeds, keeps down annual weed growth and discourages the rest. During last year's hot summer, we only watered veg at planting time, and the soil kept its moisture and structure beautifully.

Allotment in Winter:



Allotment in Summer:



We rarely have to pull a weed, and if we do it's weak, having had to struggle through all that mulch, and is as easy to remove as an annual weed - of which we get none at all, they can't germinate through the mulch and you're not disturbing them by digging.

This is a hefty post FATBAGS sorry to anyone who's seen these pics and is fed up with them, but hopefully shows more options to deal with cooch and weed fatigue . Hope you get lots of responses from other peeps with labour-saving methods too - and that you have better luck and less labour next year


SSx

[4pygmies]

Bless you Supersprouts for a good and thorough reply. Some very interesting points raised which I shall ponder for the next few weeks. My veggie garden is about 30m X 30m and is smack in the middle of my garden next to my 30ft polytunnel. I have built a fence round it to keep my old chooks out and it is hedged at the back with a flower border along the front. Half my indecision stems from the fact that it's hard to visualise what the place will look like without raised beds and I worry slightly about not having space for all the various bits I want. It's difficult to change a mind set sometimes isn't it?
Your allotment looks fantastic btw. I would like to have mine looking half as efficient by the summer......I have tried many ways to get rid of couch grass but to no avail. Sadly I am the only gardener in my family and I simply don't have the time to regularly attack the weeds. And I have to be careful with black plastic as the rats have crawled underneath whenever I have used it!
Still, lots of things to think about now - thanks very much X

[isabella]

We have deep beds in our veg garden -they have been edged with scrounged small paving slabs and have slabbed paths between the beds - the old patio and also the cheapest slabs we could find.

It does make ' housekeeping' a lot easier

[4pygmies]

And it looks immaculate Isabella!

[Deleted]

Crikey, don't it just! Hope you're well chuffed with the fruit of your labours Isabella! I do love it when people post pictures, thanks for the inspiration Love the little pot of parsley, small touches like that make so much difference.

The unedged beds/heavy mulch works well for an allotment - I'm always conscous of storing up trouble for the next tenant. FATBAGS as you have your own garden so your choice of materials is broader. Flags won't give you the same problems with slugs etc. as wood. You could start with an 'impermanent' layout, refine it for a few seasons so you're sure it will grow what you want, and gather materials and resources for a more permanent layout like Isabella's in the Fullness of Time

[isabella]

We do have deep beds on one of our allotments but I don't have any photos - must take some

[Deleted]

Goodness me that's fantastically perfect.......I'm off to cower in shame.

What are those things on the ends of the netting canes?

[isabella]

Empty yoghurt drink bottles - stops us poking our eyes out,hopefully

[Deleted]

Wow Isabella, i'm green with envy at your plot. It's immaculate.

I have divided my beds into paths and planting.....the paths are covered with the rougher cut bark chips (the cats don't like the rougher cut stuff).

The edging boards are to edge the bed and keep the bark in place but i like the idea of the slab edging. I don't seem to have problems with beasties living in the wood edging but maybe because it's not buried.

photos1.blogger.com/blogger/4456/3468/1600/P2270023.0.jpg

[Chuckles]

What a fab thread you have started 4P

I'm green with envy tooooooooooooo of everything I've just seen and the info is brill. Absolutely fab from everyone and pics. I love seeing pics, it so helps to get the whole idea in your head especially for a beginner like me ;D.

[4pygmies]

It's interesting isn't it? I'm just in a puzzle as to how to make my veggie garden slightly easier to manage so I get time to actually garden instead of weeding the blinking paths (I used the mower where possible last summer!)....everyone has a different way really. I have decided that unless you put in the effort at the start with raised beds and lay proper paths, it's too difficult to weed them properly. My gardening is always done on the cheap and with the pressure of time! I'm going to pull the whole lot up and start again this year.....my OH has promised to help (I don't think he was listening ...). I have so much space in my garden - it's ridiculous not to use it. It's back to Plan A from fifteen years ago!

[Deleted]

I've seen both sets of pics before and never tire of seeing them again. They are my inspiration. ;D

In my back garden veggie plot, I put down old compost bags, forked them, then put bark down last year for my paths. Still weed free (or just the odd one pokes up but is easy to remove) but the bark is pretty flat and soaking wet now. My deep/raised beds were all imported compost last year so no weeds then. This year might be different !

Now for the stupid bit .... Isabella, what type of netting do you use ? I get confused with netting !

;D

[Deleted]

isabella said:

We do have deep beds on one of our allotments but I don't have any photos - must take some

Yes please Isabella! ;D

[isabella]

Hello mrskp, OH gets the netting from the shop on the allotment site - I think it is 4 metres wide and costs about a £1 a metre - it does stop the bl**dy cats and fox digging holes everywhere

[isabella]

Hello 4p, Most of the paving slabs on the allotment were freebies

Our eldest son has his own gardening business and let us have any old slabs when he was redoing patios for customers.

Another lot came from a skip - youngest son noticed them and asked the owner if he could have them

I suppose it's being in the right place at the right time and also keeping your eyes peeled

[4pygmies]

And having an OH who is interested and helpful is a serious bonus too Isabella!
I walk my dogs in the Forest regularly and investigate every pile of rubbish dumped illegally hopefully. So far I have got some fantastic timber for a raised bed, a glass trolley which is used for seed trays in the GH and a pile of bricks for my "found" path in the flower garden. No slabs though........and nothing disgusting either thankfully!

[Chuckles]

Ooooh 4P your just like me, recycle any good finds. If you were nearer I'd share the second hand decking boards I got today. Was lucky OH was working in the village and I was taking them cups of T, heard a conversation about some decking being taken up. Was in there like a rat up a drain pipe (sorry about the rat). Was really suprised when OH brought it home today, he normally makes out he's forgot.

Hope your going to post some before and progress pics for us ;D

[Deleted]

thanks isabella, but is it the green plastic stuff that won't stay in one place when you stretch it out or is it a more obedient variety ? ;D

[4pygmies]

Chuckles - you are VERY lucky.....I would kiss a rat if he gave me wood like that (not really )!

[Chuckles]

4pygmies said:

Chuckles - you are VERY lucky.....I would kiss a rat if he gave me wood like that (not really )!

I did the OH ;D. I think I'm going to build another raised bed with some of it, not yet though. Some are short bits which i will use as bits to lay on the ground across the veg gdn to walk on. The rest will get stored away until I have a brain storming idea on what to use it for

[isabella]

Hello mrskp, the netting is the obedient variety ;D

[isabella]

Hello 4p, Prattling on about this and that I sometimes forget that both me and OH are interested in gardening- sorry!

I must admit that OH does all the heavy work in the garden and on the allotment - my jobs are watering,seed sowing,cuttings taking,designing() the garden,sweeping and plant placement!
Well,he is retired and up to the last couple of weeks I have been working hard ;D
I am hoping to be able to help on the allotment this year.

There is no way I would be able to cope with the garden on my own

[Deleted]

Those Pitures, from both plots, are quite inspiring. I've got itchy feet and want to get started on my version....... must resist starting too early! I've got 1m square raised beds. They are made from Recylced Black Plastic from Linkaboard, mainly because I needed something simple and quick to build and the wood I already had was rotting.

Really like the idea of mulching, never thought of the fact that worms would take the nutrients down into the soil for the roots to take up. You learn something new every day. Would grass cuttings work in the same way as straw?

[Deleted]

Thank you paul, and yes!

I use straw because it's cheap and easy to get hold of and I can carry it about.

You can use any organic material to make mulch. Some will improve the soil, other types feed the plants as well. With grass, make sure the layers are shallow (<2") so's it doesn't heat up. One of my chums mulches with grass he gets from the next door cemetery, others mulch with coffee grounds, raw and mature compost, raw and mature manure, spent hops, leaves and leafmould, straw, paper and plant shreddings, and hay. Some types of mulch look a lot better than others!

If you decide to try mulching, make it heavy - up to 8". If weeds come through, the mulch isn't thick enough!

Mulch is useful for starting off onions, when you sow sets, if you mulch over the top with 2" of loose grass, hay or straw. Grass is better IMO because it's slightly darker and will warm the soil up a little more than a light mulch. The layer of mulch hides the onion shoots from the birds whilst the roots are getting a purchase

More information at www.suite101.com/article.cfm/simple_homesteading/60401

I'd love to know how you get on with it if you decide to experiment

[Deleted]

Thanks supersprout, just got my Sturon onion sets delivered so I will definately try the mulching method with them.

What happens at the end of the season, does it all rot down and do you dig it into the soil in winter?

[mickthecactus]

Isabella, that's an absolute work of art.

[Deleted]

paul said:

Thanks supersprout, just got my Sturon onion sets delivered so I will definately try the mulching method with them.

What happens at the end of the season, does it all rot down and do you dig it into the soil in winter?

It rots down and disappears! Top up with more mulch whenever it looks like the bed needs it. The worms do the work!
If you like digging, by all means dig in - but mulch the surface afterwards so the annual weeds don't pop up again.

If you lift up a 'flap' of mulch, you can see loads of worms merrily going about their business, fair warms the cockles! ;D

[Deleted]

Excellent, I prefer the no dig approach anyway. I'll give it a go if I can find enough material to do it with

[Cheerypeabrain]

What gorgeous beds! I feel inspired. I shall show OH this thread when I can as I'm sure that he'll take in the information and come up with something suitable for our back garden.